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Perek 8

Mishnayos Sanhedrin Perek 8 Mishnah 4

סנהדרין פרק ח׳ משנה ד׳

4
If his father wishes to have him punished but his mother does not wish that, or if his father does not wish to have him punished but his mother wishes that, he does not become a stubborn and rebellious son, unless they both wish that he be punished. Rabbi Yehuda says: If his mother was not suited for his father, the two being an inappropriate match, as the Gemara will explain, he does not become a stubborn and rebellious son. If one of the parents was without hands, or lame, or mute, or blind, or deaf, their son does not become a stubborn and rebellious son, as it is stated: “Then shall his father and his mother lay hold of him, and bring him out to the elders of his city and to the gate of his place. And they shall say to the elders of his city: This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious; he will not obey our voices; he is a glutton and a drunkard” (Deuteronomy 21:19–20). The Sages derive: “Then shall his father and his mother lay hold of him,” but not people without hands, who cannot do this. “And bring him out,” but not lame people, who cannot walk. “And they shall say,” but not mutes. “This son of ours,” but not blind people, who cannot point to their son and say “this.” “He will not obey our voices,” but not deaf people, who cannot hear whether or not he declined to obey them. After he is brought before the elders of the city, he is admonished before three people and then they flog him for having stolen. If he sins again, he is judged by a court of twenty-three judges, but he is not stoned unless the first three judges before whom he had been flogged are present there, as it is stated: “This son of ours,” this is the son who was already flogged before you. If the rebellious son ran away before he was sentenced, and afterward, before he was caught, his lower beard grew around, he is exempt from the death penalty. Once his lower beard grows around his genitals, he can no longer be judged as a stubborn and rebellious son. But if he ran away only after he was sentenced, and afterward, by the time he was caught, his lower beard had already grown around, he is liable to receive the death penalty. Once he is sentenced to death his sentence remains in force.

הָיָה אָבִיו רוֹצֶה וְאִמּוֹ אֵינָהּ רוֹצָה, אָבִיו אֵינוֹ רוֹצֶה וְאִמּוֹ רוֹצָה, אֵינוֹ נַעֲשֶׂה בֵן סוֹרֵר וּמוֹרֶה, עַד שֶׁיְּהוּ שְׁנֵיהֶם רוֹצִים. רַבִּי יְהוּדָה אוֹמֵר, אִם לֹא הָיְתָה אִמּוֹ רְאוּיָה לְאָבִיו, אֵינוֹ נַעֲשֶׂה בֵן סוֹרֵר וּמוֹרֶה. הָיָה אֶחָד מֵהֶם גִּדֵּם אוֹ חִגֵּר אוֹ אִלֵּם אוֹ סוּמָא אוֹ חֵרֵשׁ, אֵינוֹ נַעֲשֶׂה בֵן סוֹרֵר וּמוֹרֶה, שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר (דברים כא) וְתָפְשׂוּ בוֹ אָבִיו וְאִמּוֹ, וְלֹא גִדְּמִין. וְהוֹצִיאוּ אֹתוֹ, וְלֹא חִגְּרִין. וְאָמְרוּ, וְלֹא אִלְּמִין. בְּנֵנוּ זֶה, וְלֹא סוּמִין. אֵינֶנּוּ שֹׁמֵעַ בְּקֹלֵנוּ, וְלֹא חֵרְשִׁין. מַתְרִין בּוֹ בִּפְנֵי שְׁלֹשָׁה וּמַלְקִין אוֹתוֹ. חָזַר וְקִלְקֵל, נִדּוֹן בְּעֶשְׂרִים וּשְׁלֹשָׁה. וְאֵינוֹ נִסְקָל עַד שֶׁיְּהוּ שָׁם שְׁלֹשָׁה הָרִאשׁוֹנִים, שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר (שם) בְּנֵנוּ זֶה, זֶהוּ שֶׁלָּקָה בִּפְנֵיכֶם. בָּרַח עַד שֶׁלֹּא נִגְמַר דִּינוֹ וְאַחַר כָּךְ הִקִּיף זָקָן הַתַּחְתּוֹן, פָּטוּר. וְאִם מִשֶּׁנִּגְמַר דִּינוֹ בָּרַח וְאַחַר כָּךְ הִקִּיף זָקָן הַתַּחְתּוֹן, חַיָּב:

ד׳

ראויה לאביו – equivalent and similar to his father in voice, in appearance and in stature, as it is written (Deuteronomy 21:20): “…he does not heed us,” since it is not written [in the Torah]: “in our voices.” We learn from this, one voice for both. And from the voice, we require that it be equivalent. Appearance and stature also we require equivalence. But the Halakha is not according to Rabbi Yehuda.

גידם – his hand is lopped off.

בננו זה – implying that we cause to see him.

חרשים – if he said to them: “I don’t accept [this] from you and they do not hear him. And even though they see afterwards, that he does not fulfill their commands. Nevertheless, the Torah stated (Deuteronomy 21:20): “...he does not heed us,” which implies at the time of voice when they speak, that he doesn’t listen, since they heard him say, “I do not accept [this] from you.

ומתרין בו בפני שלשה– This is how this should be understood: And they warn him before two [witnesses] that he should not become accustomed, and if he did not listen, they would flog him with a Jewish court of three, as is taught [in the Mishnah] of the first chapter [of Sanhedrin] (Mishnah 2): “Flogging – through a court of three. That (Deuteronomy 21:18): “even after they discipline him,” which is stated in the case of the wayward and defiant son [refers to] flogging. It is written here (Deuteronomy 21:18): “A wayward and defiant son” and it is written there (Deuteronomy 25:2): “If the guilty one is to be flogged…”

זה הוא שלקה בפניכם – and even though this is required for excluding blind person, if there is for this thing alone that he comes, for this one that he is flogged in their presence, [the Bible] should have written, “he is our son.” What is “this son of ours” (Deuteronomy 21:20)? You learn two things from it:

ןאח"כ הקיף זקן התחתון פטור – since that he had ac ted now, he is not guilty of a capital crime.

ואם משנגמר דינו ברכח – he is like a man who is to be put to death, and is guilty, even after a few years.

ראויה לאביו. שוה ודומה לאביו בקול במראה וקומה. דכתיב איננו שומע בקולנו, מדלא כתיב בקולותינו, שמע מינה קול אחד לשניהם. ומדקול בעינן שוים, מראה וקומה נמי בעינן שוים. ואין הלכה כרבי יהודה:

גידם. ידו קטועה:

בננו זה. משמע שמראין אותו:

חרשים. אם אמר להם איני מקבל מכם אינם שומעים אותו. ואע״פ שרואים אח״כ שאינו מקיים מצותן, מ״מ התורה אמרה איננו שומע בקולנו, דמשמע דבשעת הקול קאמרי דלא שמע, ששמעוהו שאמר איני מקבל מכם:

ומתרין בו בפני שלשה. הכי קאמר, ומתרין בו בפני שנים שלא ירגיל. ואם לא שמע, מלקין אותו בבית דין של שלשה, כדתנן בפרק קמא, מכות בשלשה. דויסרו אותו האמור בבן סורר ומורה מלקות הוא, כתיב הכא (דברים כ״א:י״ח) בן סורר ומורה, וכתיב התם (שם כ״ח) והיה אם בן הכות הרשע:

זה הוא שלקה בפניכם. ואע״ג דמיבעי ליה זה ולא סומין, אי איתא דלהך מלתא לחוד אתא, לזה הוא שלקה בפניכם, לכתוב בננו הוא, מאי בננו זה שמעת מינה תרתי:

ואח״כ הקיף זקן התחתון פטור. כיון דאילו עביד השתא לאו בר קטלא הוא:

ואם משנגמר דינו ברח. הוי כגברא קטילא וחייב אפילו לאחר כמה שנים: